I Stand Corrected: Apparently it’s NOT Misogyny if the Victim is Republican
October 17, 2008
by Amy Siskind
|Marilyn Fitterman, a former head of NOW NY, responded to a recent post on Kitty Genovese and Sarah Palin. In her widely circulated email, Fitterman gives the following observations of Gov. Palin:
“She is being treated by the media in the way all women have come to expect from time immemorial. More to the point, Sarah Palin is collaborating with the patriarchy.”
In other words, Marilyn believes that women should NOT speak out and defend Gov. Palin. After all, Gov. Palin doesn’t believe in the same policies as Marilyn (although, Marilyn, you are factually incorrect on most of the points with which you take issue). However, that’s not the point. The point is that in Marilyn’s Old Feminist regime, only Democratic Women who are pro choice need defending. The Old Feminists look down their noses at a hockey-mom (I coach girls and boys basketball, so I must really be trash, Marilyn, collaborating with the patriarchy).
The New Feminists believe that ALL women deserve respect in this country—no matter their party or beliefs on choice.
So a big “thank you” to Marilyn for pointing out the stark contrast between what was the old, and what will be the new.
(Note: Fitterman’s email follows)
Principles Over Personalities
I was 25 years old in March of 1964, so I’ll never forget the horrifying happening in Queens, headlined in every news media. It scared the hell out of all young women, especially those like me, who were city people. A young woman, coming home late from work, was attacked right in front of her apartment. The attacker stabbed her numerous times and, as she was screaming for help, neighbors turned on their lights, opened their windows and, although they heard her pleading “help me, I’m dying,” not one called the police, even though this attack took place over a period of at least fifteen minutes.
The woman, Kitty Genovese, whom we all came to know as Kitty, made it to the door of her building only to find it locked. Kitty then crawled to the rear door and made it into the vestibule of the building, all the while crying out for help. The attacker, who had left ten minutes earlier, then returned to, in his words “finish the job.” He found Kitty in the vestibule, stabbed her a few more times, then cut off her clothing and raped her. Still no one called the police. At least 38 neighbors had what they thought were good excuses not to get involved.
It has come to my attention that The New Agenda, a group of women who organized to fight the kind of criticism that Hillary received in her presidential primary, has put out a statement comparing the criticism of Sarah Palin to the fatal knife attack on Kitty Genovese. There couldn’t be a more specious and ridiculous assessment.
We, who have been fighting for women’s rights most of our lives, hold that principles surpass personality. Sarah Palin is not being stabbed and raped. She is being treated by the media in the way all women have come to expect from time immemorial.
More to the point, Sarah Palin is collaborating with the patriarchy. Her six-pack Joe and hockey-mom remarks, her winks and “you betcha’s,” play right into the stereotypes we have been fighting against for hundreds of years. She also invites the “First Dude” to work right alongside her, making decisions in the Governor’s office, creating the appearance that she is unable to carry the load by herself. Palin’s adherence to such patriarchal expectations is giving her some immunity to media criticism. The bar for her has been lowered to the point where, if she forms a complete sentence on the subject at point, the media congratulates her. The orchestration of media bias against Hillary Clinton has been blasted by enough women to actually somewhat protect Sarah Palin.
Palin and McCain have promised to pass laws and appoint justices so the government can control my body; she wants to “cure” lesbian and gay people, and wants to teach creationism as opposed to science in the schools. But as Gloria Steinem recently explained, feminism is not about getting a job for one woman, but rather about improving the situation for all women. In other words, it is about the principle of equality, not about one individual regardless of her principles.
Sarah Palin does not improve the situation. And now the Republican Party keeps her away from interviews for fear she’ll put her foot in her mouth. Is that really who we want to represent women? Will this help us achieve equality faster? Absolutely not, it is, in fact what has been called the subtle prejudice of lowered expectations.
As feminists we should reject lowered expectations and we should resist patriarchal laws. We should remember to hold principles above personalities.
The New Agenda should apologize to Kitty Genovese’s family for their awful and disrespectful analogy.
Email Marilyn Fitterman.
Wow. This should no longer be shocking, but it is. And very hurtful. I’m a long time dem but it cuts me to the core to see women being so hurtful and so violent – yes violent – towards other women. I am sorry that I am not able to identify with NOW NY, as I would like to be able to be able to identify with a longtime feminist organization. I guess I am on the outs – or they are.
Sad. You would think NOW would understand the basic principle of how sisterhood is powerful. Girls must learn how to hold hands and stick together.
You would also think NOW would have a better grasp of history. Some of our best feminist icons were Republicans. Elizabeth Cady Stanton, for instance. Alice Paul was a woman so fed up with Democrats and their misogyny she went on to form the National Womens’ party. The first woman elected to congress was Jeannette Rankin, a Republican. The first woman to have her name placed in nomination for the presidency at a convention was a Republican.
So I guess according to NOW, I’m going to have to start attacking all my feminist heroes for not being Democrats. I wonder, does that extend to Cynthia McKinney and Rosa Clemente? Just saying, because the Green party has two women of color running on a feminist platform! Hello? NOW?
Amy, I thought your initial column on the Kitty Genovese case was incisive and astute. The case is widely discussed in social psychology classes as an example of “bystander apathy” or “diffusion of responsibility” – either of which rightly describes the role too many “progressive” people in the political races this year.
Fitterman’s email does not address the points you made. Rather, Fitterman responds to you as though you are an undiscriminating Palin supporter. She’s following a rich political tradition of responding to the question she wishes she’d been asked, rather than the content of the allegation you make.
The longer this goes on, the more obvious the need for people to cast off their apathy and begin responding to the no-holds-barred politically motivated misogyny of their erstwhile allies.
Thanks for providing the vehicle by which the boat can be rocked with vigor, and thanks for providing such a compelling voice.
This statement by Marilyn is not accurate: “Palin and McCain have promised to pass laws and appoint justices so the government can control my body; she wants to “cure” lesbian and gay people, and wants to teach creationism as opposed to science in the schools.”
Also, I do believe that there is a hypocritical double standard being rehashed about McCain insulating Palin from the media. You know, she was thrust on the national stage and had a rather dishonest editing of her first interview with Gibson… That was shameful and I hear no outcries over that. I do recall a time (after Hillary cleaned Obama’s clock) when Obama’s campaign not only canceled any more debates, but kept his press corps at arms length as well.
Palin has an unusual way of speaking that is folksy and honest. To some, her lack of an Ivy League education and interesting use of syntax makes her unqualified…
I also take exception of using Palin’s partner as a reason to make her unqualified. Obama has said that Michelle has been a helpmate for him in his political career. What about Bill saying you get” two for one” when he ran for president? What, a woman must do it alone??
The old wave of Feminism has paved the way for good things for women, but also bad. The misogyny is more crass and violent toward women. We are still objectified as sex objects. Sarah Palin, winking at her father when she mentions that he is a school teacher, did not invite the treatment she has received by the likes of the old guard feminists and sexists. I get from Marilyn’s letter that Sarah Palin asked for it… Marilyn is worse than the bystander that stands there and does nothing, she is out there casting stones and telling others that it is OK to do so.
I always thought (before this election) that feminists fought for equal rights, equal pay, fair treatment – to fight sexism. Since Palin, I now see that these “old feminists” are about a legal platform (e.g., choice). Ok, so now I understand why none of them stepped up to the plate and fought for a fair and honest primary for Hillary Rodham Clinton.
These “old feminists” are part of the problem and the reason why the media and the DNC were able to steal the nomination from the best candidate for president in my lifetime.
Thank you to the New Agenda – I hope this is the begining of real feminism.
Kitkat – A New Feminist
ps. I am an independent – I have never been registered with either party and am a 39 year old mother of two. Just for context.
I want to add that my 11 year-old daughter is studying politics in 6th grade social studies. She told me today that she is the only girl in her class that likes Gov. Palin. She said 4 girls confronted her (pack mentality – also learned) today to say that Sen. McCain has cancer (it’s a secret) and will die and then what will we do? My daughter told them that she thinks Gov. Palin would be a great President.
Then I was thinking…what are the mothers of these girls teaching their daughters at home? To attack other women. We are programmed that way. Diminish, demean – it’s in the culture. I’m proud of my daughter for standing alone. I’m proud that she has learned to stand up for another woman and feels comfortable with women in power. She is learning also to respect and be a friend to girls now and then to women later in life.
When this race is over, one of our country’s biggest challenges is for women to re-engineer our treatment of one another and what we pass down to our children!
I agree Amy. Our daughters learn many things from us, what we do and how we handle our relationships are very important.
I am so proud of my daughter. She is a freshman in college. I never made having a boyfriend important. I encouraged her to get involved in things she finds interesting. She learned that being a part of something you cared about and working with others was more meaningful and fulfilling than having a date to the prom or a having a boyfriend. (Too many moms really push their daughters to date!)
I am optimistic when I watch my daughter. She is entering the world knowing that she is whole just as she is, that other women are for support and friendship (not competition for the boyfriend), and that she can be anything she wants to be. The world is at her doorstep. If she finds a partner along they way, great, but if not, she will have a fulfilling life full of friends.
“We should resist patriarchal laws” she says – yeh, like Obama’s pay scale for women? From her exclusionary perspective and by her living definition of feminism, she is clearly on the hind teat of the Obama political udder and is not even aware of it. How frail and vulnerable – no wonder they allowed Hillary to be turned into a cunt. I can hear their male precinct Captains with their bullhorns, bellowing at them, “Who’s your Daddy!? Who’s your Daddy!?” Can’t you?
Amy,
Now I am as proud of your daughter as I am of you.
Not only has my party degraded sucessful women like Hillary Clinton and Sarah Palin but they have also displayed a kind of facist attitude about a candidate with cancer. How backwards are these democrats who would discount a candidate who has survived cancer. I wonder why Elizabeth Edwards has nothing to say about this most embarrassing scare tactic. Did you see the dispicable ad the Brave New World pac ran on MSNBC about McCain and cancer. My God! This behavior is relatable to Eugenics in Nazi Germany. Its not surprising that the followers that would excuse Obama’s support for infanticide would have this kind of mind set. I think that many of our Obama supporters might even have a difficult time looking at a child with Downs syndrom. They are morally bankrupt and probably worthy of an Obama presidency.
Leisa, damn straight that crap from Marilyn is not accurate. In fact, that is precisely where I quit reading, and I wrote to her about that, asking:
Why don’t you INFORM yourself rather than parrot the talking points of the character assassins of Sarah Palin who spread this bs that you continue to fling..
“…she wants to ‘cure’ lesbian and gay people, and wants to teach creationism as opposed to science in the schools..”
That’s as far as I read in your screed because apparently you are content to shut off your brain rather than find the facts, let alone make salient points.
And I’d bet the house you kowtow to the likes of the misogynist Obama, who said the VERY same thing as Palin on creationism in school and who is FAR worse on gay issues than she is, having campaigned (and continues to campaign to this day) with active homophobes and Christian “ex-gays.”
=======
In fact, neither Obama nor Palin said creationism should be in the curriculum, just that it should be part of the discussion if brought up. As to “curing” gays, it was another church which advertised this in Palin’s church bulletin….meanwhile, Obama’s been campaigning with these ex-gays and homophobes!
maybe Marilyn should consider the idea that NOW has enslaved itself to the patriarchy in the Democratic Party. NOW seems to not care whether a candidate is a rampaging misogynist, as long as he votes pro-choice.
also–I’m pretty sure I read something last week about Obama being joined on the campaign trail by none other than Chris Matthews, who wants to run for Arlen Specter’s senate seat in Pennsylvania. TNA’ers in Pennsylvania, beware–the king of misogyny in journalism is coming to your state, and when he arrives it will undoubtedly be with the endorsement of President Obama.
Thank you for this post. I am dumbfounded and do not quite know how to answer. I did not know a political party owned the idea of feminism. I did not realize that only certain women owned the term feminism and could call themselves as such. I have always thought that feminism stands for striving for equality. I did not realize how wrong I have been.
This whole political climate has opened my eyes to realities of being a woman. I thought that the feminist movement tries to give voice to the women and their struggles. It seems it has become a political strong arm for putting the nails on the glass ceiling they once wanted to break. I guess I missed the point when ‘the right to choose’ turned into ‘the right to choose the right choice, the one choice.’
Sarah Palin has made me look at myself, my values and who I am and what I stand for. Some things she believes in, I do not. But she comes across as a person who would listen to my concerns and I might even have an interesting conversation with her. She has showed me a side that I did not realize existed. And now I know why it did not exist in my life before.
The feminist movement has become a monopoly: their choice, their voice, their way or noway. Maybe it worked at one time, but times have changed. And when times change, you must adapt. I am grateful for the feminist movement of the past and the present. I hope the dialogue continues. I will not stand by and let Sarah Palin to be vilified for being a woman. I stand by her, like I stood by Hillary Clinton. They are different women and aren’t we lucky to have them.
Sorry to be so long and rambling. This was from my heart and thoughts that I have been rolling in my head for some time now. Stream of consciousness kind of writing. I lurk here a bit and I am glad I have found you and your company.
Thank you.
KayJL on October 18th, 2008 4:19 am
maybe Marilyn should consider the idea that NOW has enslaved itself to the patriarchy in the Democratic Party. NOW seems to not care whether a candidate is a rampaging misogynist, as long as he votes pro-choice.
___________________________
NOW’s actions have shocked me . . . NOW is really not for women, but a pro-choice organization like NARAL. Why has NOW not fought the Obama campaign on its unequal pay of women in the campaign.
Thank you to the New Agenda and all the commenters on this blog. I am so grateful to find fellow women that really care about women’s rights, respecting that, although women may think differently, they should be treated with respect and equality.
Amy and Leisa: I hope to have the same success with raising my daughter (just 5). Kudos to you both.
Amy, Hope you’ll let your group know that for about 35 years I was a registered Republican. In fact when I was elected to the presidency of NOW New York State I was a Republican. I don’t consider myself an arm of any party. I’m for women’s and human rights. We should all look at the individual and what they stand for and vote accordingly. Sarah Palin does not represent most women who struggle for equality therefore, she does not represent me or mine.
“She is being treated by the media in the way all women have come to expect from time immemorial.” And she is happy with that? Fitterman (what a name to conjure with – but oh so obvious) is the one who should be feeling shame if she endorses the way the media treat women. Denialism has reached epidemic proportions, it seems.
I view NOW as the Ladies’ Auxillary of the Democratic Party, and I was a Democrat until a few months ago. Now I’m a “gynocrat”. Sarah Palin does represent the way I struggle everyday for equality. I do it by living it. If NOW doesn’t represent her, then it doesn’t represent me. If NOW wants to encompass all feminists, all women who are working for equality for women, it would have refrained from endorsing either presidential candidate and focused on issues that affect us all. How much did NOW get paid to sell us out, Marilyn?
Ms. Fitterman, this is not about who is Republican and who is Democrat. This is about double standard. I know we wrote to NOW in the primaries. I know NOW took action. But I also know, NOW took action against Sarah Palin and her CHOICE. That is what this is about to me. You made it into a single choice issue. Erica Jong called Gov. Palin “white trash” like it was nothing, Eve Ensler talked about the horrors of “drill, drill, drill”. I wrote to Eve Ensler and asked her to speak against Keith Olbermann taking Hillary to “a room and only one person coming out.” Not a peep from her. But a “drill, drill, drill” has her having nightmares? Double standard.
If you choose to take a stand for “women’s and human rights”, then do it always, do not choose who is worth your attention and who is not. The Democratic Party has mired itself in elitism and who is worth their time and attention. Just look how they sneer at “Joe the plumber”. Is NOW going to do the same? Are you going to single out certain women not worth your respect or are you going to have a dialogue? It is fine not to agree with Gov. Palin and her stance. What is not ok, is to attack her viciously, call her names, and paint horror pictures of her based on MSM talking points and half-truths, just because she does not agree with you. That is cowardice and disrespectful.
I hope the dialogue continues.
Amy – because a number of your members have been emailing me and think I made up the information about Palin and her views on abortion and gay rights, I am forwarding this information which is on the record.
Sarah Palin’s Position on Pro-life
I am pro-life and I believe that marriage should only be between and man and a woman.
Source: Campaign website, http://www.palinforgovernor.com, “Issues” Nov 7, 2006
Choose life, even if her own daughter were raped
The candidates were pressed on their stances on abortion and were even asked what they would do if their own daughters were raped and became pregnant.
Palin said she would support abortion only if the mother’s life was in danger. When it came to her daughter, she said, “I would choose life.”
Source: Alaska 2006 Governor Debate: AP coverage of public TV debate Nov 3, 2006
JP speaks for me! Many of the women here do. I am amazed that some women who consider themselves astute, considered individuals would so transparently embrace brand for brand’s sake. That’s not astute or considered; it’s habitual and shallow.
Gosh, Marilyn, there you go again. Why don’t you look these things up? Read Sarah Palin’s interview with Katie Couric:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories.....age3.shtml
On abortion: Palin is firmly pro-life, but is respectful of other’s opinions on the issue. She characterizes her views as her personal belief, what she would “counsel” other women. She has shied away repeatedly from any indication that she would try to impose her anti-abortion stance legally.
On evolution: She believes that evolution should be taught in schools as accepted scientific doctrine. She does not believe creationism should be taught as part of any curriculum or in any science class.
On gay marriage: Her position is virtually identical to Barack Obama’s: that she personally thinks marriage is between a man and a woman, but she loves and accepts gay people.
Marilyn, what I’d really love for you to do is explain to us how spreading lies about a woman candidate represents a blow for feminism. Just what kind of feminism is that, exactly?
I’d also be fascinated to learn what type of feminism sees a Midwestern accent and hockey as evils we’ve been battling for centuries. I’ve been a feminist since 1971, and this is the first I’ve heard that the phrase “you betcha” is a big threat to women’s equality.
“But what ultimately I believe is that women in consultation with their families, their doctors, their religious advisers, are in the best position to make this decision.”
Source: New York 2008 Presidential Debate, Oct 15, 2008
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories.....5254.shtml
Ms. Fitterman in your example Gov. Palin says “I would choose life”. She clearly talks about herself. What is alarming to me in Sen. Obama’s answer in the quote above, is that he clearly talks about what women should do. Not only that he “ultimately” believes women should “consult” other people before making any decisions. Now maybe I am being just a little bit too picky here, but if Gov. Palin’s every word awards scrutiny so should Sen. Obama’s. Or are we to assume that just because he is a Democrat, he automatically upholds the Democratic values. What ever they may be in this regard or any other, because depending on the audience Sen. Obama seems to chance his positions.
If Sarah Palin chooses life, that is her choice. She is entitled to it, is she not? What is Obama’s position here? What does he mean with these words? Or should we not wonder? Should we just take him for his word of being a Democrat? As I understand he indeed has demonstrated that he is for abortion, but is he for woman’s right to choose or should women consult others before making any decisions? To me yielding to Sen. Obama’s view of consulting feels like “collaborating with the patriarchy” as you put it.
JP: Both responses are double-speak. In both cases, they are inviting the audience to interpret their remarks.
In Palin’s answer, pro-life people will hear, “I choose life (for everyone)”, while pro-choice people may interpret that as, “I choose life (but it’s a personal choice)”. In Obama’s remarks, pro-choice folks will hear, “It’s a woman’s decision (with the support of her family, etc)” and pro-life folks may interpret it as, “A woman’s family and church are the ultimate arbiters of her choice.”
Hearing Obama phrase it that way during the debate gave me chills, but I don’t like either answer.
The truth is, no woman who is feminist enough to suit my standards will ever make it into public office in the US. In Canada (where I currently reside) we just re-elected Libby Davies in my riding. Libby is feminist enough for me: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libby_Davies
If neither Hillary Clinton nor Sarah Palin is feminist enough for feminists, what woman will ever make it through that gauntlet?
It is incredible that anyone thinks Palin is not anti-choice. Below is the link to a video where Governor Sarah Palin can be seen and heard saying Roe should be overturned. She is running on a ticket with a man who has for decades advocated overturning Roe with Court appointments. How anyone believes the contrary is a mystery. SandyRapp@aol.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llEpm7Kvjm8
Dawn C, I interpreted the answers as double-speak as well. The reason why I brought up this example is the double standard that seems to prevail in the media. Gov. Palin’s words are scrutinized and manipulated to mean just one thing, while Sen. Obama’s words are, well, manipulated to mean one thing, but hardly scrutinized. At least I did not hear an outcry from the MSM for Sen.Obama to explain his words. But, yes it is double-speak, form of speaking that is hardly uncommon in the world of politics.
And you expressed my sentiments exactly with this:
If neither Hillary Clinton nor Sarah Palin is feminist enough for feminists, what woman will ever make it through that gauntlet?
I have been quietly asking this myself.
Thank you for your reply and sharing your thoughts with me.
The women who are buying what the democrats are selling this season are content to carry water for George Soro’s dollars. They cannot defend Palin now because that would cost big dollars. They sold themselves to the all male woman bashing show that has been the Obama campaign. They cannot stand up to it when they get monetary benefit from it.
Hillary Clinton wasn’t good enough because she was a woman, Palin isn’t good enough for the same reason because when you get down to it you know that no man would be taken to task the way these two were for the reasons stated.
If you take abortion off the table it’s the same attack dogs. What I see the misogynists doing is using one issue or the other as their excuse to let unleashed deep seated hatred of women. They speak in terms utterly unnecessary to their arguments.
What is so baffling is that now these same people are saying to some women that Obama’s policies are the same as Hillary’s and therefore we should vote for him. To that I say to them “And SHE was far more qualified so why did you not vote for her instead?”
N.O.W. has done very little lately to address and advance women’s issues other than choice which is a fight already won. I hope they do not intend to use all that contribution money they got for endorsing Obama on media attacks such as this upon other women.
Marilyn and Sandy,
I would strongly suggest that you take a deep breathe and then reread the article that you so severely and widely criticized. I must say yet again – you missed the point of the piece. If this were English 101 instead of Psych 101, you would get a grade “D” for writing a long essay, but not reading the question (or as Dawn had put it – answering the question you hoped was being asked).
There is no endorsement of Gov. Palin or her policies. The piece speaks to the misogyny aimed at Gov. Palin by men AND women of the Democratic Party, and asks – didn’t we all say out loud that after what happened to Hillary, we would never let this happen to another woman again. Who cares about her policies – that is not pertinent – what is pertinent is she is a women being belittled, degraded and raped with words. And we must speak out for her and have it stop. Let issues and policies decide who we vote for.
Now, on another issue, I think if any apology is owed, it is one owed BY Ms. Fitterman to the founders of The New Agenda. Based on the emails from women around the country, that is what is called for here!
But I always encourage a discourse on any issue so for that Marilyn thank you. I think your piece goes a long way towards showing the turning of the page from old feminism to new feminism.
The early 70’s rhetoric lives on: “collaborating with the patriarchy.” What has N.O.W. been doing for the past 35 years while porn has become mainstream and we’re at the point where they’re making a porn movie about Gov. Palin? N.O.W. has no problem with the “Sarah Palin is a c***” T-shirts?
Where was N.O.W. during the primaries while Hillary was subjected to the most vile misogyny from the supposedly “progressive” Obama supporters and his cheerleaders in the media? N.O.W. was busy collaborating with the patriarchy in the form of the DNC, no doubt taking their money and falling in line to support Obama.
Absolutely, it was all about getting their hands on that Soros cash. N.O.W. got some of that in the form of a donation. The D.N.C. has a sugar daddy who said “It’s our party now, we own it.” An old white man who is a billionaire is calling all the shots and in his world it’s all okay.
Then we have the Obama campaign taking money from Playboy and Maxim magazines and giving that money to N.O.W. while staying silent for and benefiting from misogyny on a scale I have not seen since I was a child.
Move On, N.O.W. and the D.N.C. whored themselves to a sugar daddy billionaire and how can they speak out when they are bought and paid for by such a man who is fond of saying how he has no issue with problems of conscience. He’s taken over whole small countries and ruined the poor there. They Chinese call him “The Crocodile”
Apt to name him that. He’s eaten and devoured every good thing the left ever stood for and now he will call ALL the shots for those beholden to him. It was TIME to break away and it’s time to hold them all accountable too.
Wow. Well I came back here to read the comments on this thread since I am one of the people Marilyn speaks of emailing her. I posted my first email to her above. I agree 100% with posters such as Violet Socks, JP, and Amy.
Marilyn wrote back to me decrying the “vitriol” with which I and my “friends” as she termed it were “spewing.”
I have yet to see the spew she’s referring to.
Here was her wording:
“Please note that the vitriolic language spewing from you and your friends is not found in the feminist movement I’ve belonged to for the past 40 years. We actually know how to have intelligent, sensible conversations even when we don’t agree. Maybe that’s why we accomplished so much.”
And my reply:
Oh, I’m too passionate for you?
Yet your repetition of lies in a character assassination is a-ok by you! I see you’re doing the same thing to me, lumping me with “and your friends” so that you can tar everyone by unspecified, implied bad behavior. Character assassination must be second nature to you.
It’s also almost humorous to note how it’s ok for you to say we “spew.” That’s not vitriol? I merely said you parrot lies instead of informing yourself of the facts. And that’s giving you the benefit of the doubt that you truly were not informed about Gov. Palin and Sen. Obama on “creationism” and ex-gays.
Now that you have been informed will you apologize, publicly? And vow never to spread those lies about Palin’s wanting creationism in the curriculum? And it was another church, not Palin’s church, which advertised in their bulletin about “curing” gays. Palin actually reinforced rights to gay people in her state. So, now that you know, will you promise to stop repeating unfounded smears, or will you continue to be an utter disgrace to women and women’s rights?
I will be sharing your answer or your dodging of it.
=========================================
And here was her reply, in total:
“you need help.”
Is there any doubt why I’m not reading any more of her emails?
I would wager that Sarah represents more women than Obama. The “feminist” movement is in deep trouble when they think a man is more like most women than a woman.
Hi Amy,
It was me who made the comment about “the question she wished had been asked”, in reference to Fitterman’s response. Her subsequent response was also notable in that she felt the need to identify herself as having Republican roots. Apparently she’s assuming this organization, and this site, are affiliated with the Republican party or their allies – so your comment about “not reading the essay” is right on.
I suppose that the political tradition of voter alienation by means of vicarious shame is venerable and rich. What is astounding (and depressing) to me in this election cycle is the ready employ of sexual and gender-based shaming by people who have traditionally been seen as allied with feminist causes. When Hillary was in the running, at least some people were willing to speak up. Now that she’s out of the race, sexism and misogyny apparently don’t matter – perhaps some feel that the ends justify the means. It’s seems ludicrous to have to say they do not.
Your detractors (Fitterman being the obvious example) would like to frame your objections within the confines of traditional political alliances, when what you’re doing is objecting to the sexism being employed in the process of what is in the best of circumstances a morally dubious strategy, and when misogynistic content is employed, completely unacceptable.
It’s heartening that at least you’re getting some attention. Perhaps if you (we) keep it up, more people will eventually allow themselves to hear what you are actually saying. In the mean time, I imagine you’re in for more of the same – people putting convenient words in your mouth and attempting to relegate your objections to the easily discounted category of partisan maneuvering.
I suppose one can hardly blame them – the job of ignoring the discomfort generated by allies spewing such vile epithets takes a fair degree of effort to maintain. Pointing out their hypocrisy is just damned inconvenient for them. Just like pointing out sexism and misogyny has always been inconvenient for people with an investment in the status quo.
I cannot thank you enough for helping me understand the nature of my continuing discomfort, and providing a vehicle to spread the seeds of actual philosophical and pragmatic reform. I’m sure the Fittermans in the world will come around eventually – I just wish they’d get on with it already. At the very least, I wish they’d take the time (and demonstrate the integrity) necessary to at least understand what it is you are saying.
samanthasmom–your characterization of NOW as the Ladies Auxiliary of the Democratic Party cracked me up. perfect description of NOW’s conduct in this election.
NOW ought to get with the program (or what was supposed to be the program) and let their patriarchs (Daddy Obama and Daddy Dean) know that Chris Matthews is not an acceptable candidate for the Pennsylvania Senate. It’s not that hard to get Obama to throw someone under the bus so NOW ought to be able to accomplish at least that much with Chris Matthews.
Ms. Fitterman,
I am astonished to see that you seem to believe the womens movement boils down to nothing but abortion.
My rights as a woman do not begin and end with abortion upon demand.
And let’s say that Palin did have those views about gays, abortion, creationism (which she doesn’t), is it ok for her to be demeaned by having her likeness portrayed in sex dolls, porn movies, and all of the other vulgar and sexual comments that have been made about her?
Let’s be honest, those disgusting things would still be happening if she was a die-hard, pro-choice liberal. The only difference is that more women would be defending her. That is what is truly disgusting.
Then can we talk about Obama campaigning for Odinga in Kenya yet? Or are we too busy Palin bashing? You know Odinga, who did INDEED sign an agreement with certain factions in Kenya to institute sharia law should he win the election.
Either Obama did not know and he’s far too gullible to be POTUS or he did know and he’s too misogynistic *which I believe he is anyway* to be POTUS.
Why are we focused so narrowly in the media on one issue and one candidate? Why does Obama get every pass on every thing INCLUDING cheating in every caucus state and the Indiana primary to STEAL the nomination from a woman. Why are people in the MSM NOT vetting him on this NOW. Later will be too late. Later will be nothing more than pandering to sell products and newspapers.
Holding women candidates to ten times the standard males are held to has grown extremely tiresome and hate filled. If anyone is NOT angry at this there is something wrong with them.
And I agree about N.O.W. too, they are the Ladies Auxiliary of the Democratic Party, what’s left of the Democratic Party anyway and that’s not much.
The media were part and parcel of hijacking the primary, Alice Paul.
They were falsely reporting that Hillary had “conceded” while people were still voting…not to mention the nonstop drumbeat for her to accept the “inevitable” and step aside, for the entire political season.
The time to report on Odinga would’ve been early this year, when his supporters were burning people alive and displacing entire towns by rioting.
Why has Obama not been questioned on this?
God knows if Hillary had gone over and campaigned for such a person and then still was talking to them in the primaries she would have been racked over the coals for years thereafter.
These people are so beneath contempt in their quest to install his majesty. All they care about is $$$$ and taking credit historically as a cherry on top but, it’s a false credit!!
This business of Obama campaigning for a man who was going to let sharia law become part of his rule is something women ought to be up in arms about. The damage that does is far above whether we ought to worry about Roe v. Wade right now. This man not going to protect ANY of our rights if he hasn’t come out by now and strongly denounced Odinga.
Pander, pander, pander and the masses are sucking it all up like xanex replacing reason and critical thought.
Sarah Palin may not stand and speak on issues feminists have fought for in some ways but, Senator Obama has taken actions that are in direct opposition to our rights too. Not standing against that blood bath of misogyny against Hillary. CHEATING her out of the nomination. Diminishing her accomplishments by repeatedly saying over and over that she was only running as a former “first lady” and that was her lions share of “experience.” He diminished her record to puff up his lack of one on issues important to US.
Had he not cheated, Hillary would be the nominee right now so in a sense he has cheated us out of OUR rightful historical moment so he can be president at the age of 47 on that resume. Another young male with less experience cheating a woman on such a high level and THATS not up for attack from feminists in the press??? Why are we not outraged in the press regarding the cheating in those caucus states, the sham roll call vote, the shouting Hillary out of the race and the actions of the D.N.C. against her while Obama gamed the system and ramped up hatred of women and lied about Hillary Clinton to win.
Palin is being held to ten times the standard Obama is yet again. EVEN women in the press think this is fine. Go after him with the same vigor you go after her for the SAME reasons.
The truth is we have no reason to believe Obama will do a damned thing for women given what he’s done TO US in the primaries.
Young female McCain Volunteer branded with B and Brutalized
http://riverdaughter.wordpress.com/
“This is breaking news and very disturbing.
A 20 year old volunteer for the McCain-Palin campaign was mugged after using an ATM. The mugger took $60 from the volunteer who was from Texas and had gone to PA to help with phone banks. After the mugging, the man that robbed this young woman noticed a McCain bumper sticker on her car. He then marked her with a B on her face, yelled obscenities and anti-McCain rhetoric at her, and assaulted her.
Here at the Confluence, River Daughter and many other writers have been warning of the violence the Obama campaign and its supporters have basically advocated by not decrying violent images of Hillary, Sarah, and their women supporters. This is vile and is exactly what misogyny produces.
I hope that this young woman recovers and that Senator Obama will take time out from his campaign to finally call the dogs off women for simply voicing their support for some one other than him. I also hope that the press finally stops reporting on ‘fake’ threats towards Obama when there are real women whose lives are put on the line by the sexism Obama supporters have incited, encouraged, and displayed. The media should also admit its culpability in this attack.”
There’s a link to the story above with a picture of the young girl.
This hatred has been stoked by the media and the Obama campaign for months now. I don’t know how many pieces my heart can break into in sixteen short months but, I’m finding out.
[...] the way, The New Agenda has been attacked by some of the Second Wave Feminists such as Marilyn Fitterman and Robin Morgan. You see, The New Agenda view the women’s rights in a somewhat unique way. We [...]
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